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Thread: need advice

  1. #1
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    Default need advice

    Hi,

    I currently have the zalman reserator fanless water cooling tower, it is cooling my cpu with the zalman block that came with it, and my 8800 with a zalman aluminum block that I bought seperately. It currenly keeps my GPU at 50c idle and 55c load. The GPU warms up the water in the radiator then the whole setup stays warm, even for a few hours after shutting down the system.

    My question is, should I add a second loop to my case for my card alone? (i.e. TT Big water, or something custom) :confused:

    The GPU block is aluminum, so I was also wondering if copper and aluminum cause corrosion when you place anti-freeze or some form of water additive, or will it always cause corrosion and theres nothing I could do about it except use an aluminum radiator? :confused:

    My plan would be to cool the CPU and both Bridges on the zalman Tower loop,

    and for the GPU loop, A DD setup, What size (model # would help a ton) pump would I need for a single 120mm Radiator and the GPU block?


    <--- sorry I had to, I love it haha

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    Hi,
    I currently have the zalman reserator fanless water cooling tower, it is cooling my cpu with the zalman block that came with it, and my 8800 with a zalman aluminum block that I bought seperately. It currenly keeps my GPU at 50c idle and 55c load. The GPU warms up the water in the radiator then the whole setup stays warm, even for a few hours after shutting down the system.
    50/55 is not bad at all considering it's on Passive WC setup.
    If you put this card on air, the temp will jump up to 60c for idle. Passive WC system take longer to disspate heat than the Active one.

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    My question is, should I add a second loop to my case for my card alone? (i.e. TT Big water, or something custom) :confused:
    nahhh... you don't have too.
    Tip: why don't you put the radiator in the front of a portable fan? a small (6") desktop one, it's not a betty sight but it will aid the rad to dissipate heat.

    If you must have a better WC system then do custom setup, the con of custom build is the cost.

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    The GPU block is aluminum, so I was also wondering if copper and aluminum cause corrosion when you place anti-freeze or some form of water additive, or will it always cause corrosion and theres nothing I could do about it except use an aluminum radiator? :confused:
    if you use a good and properly quality coolant than you want have any problem with corrosion even with aluminum.

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    My plan would be to cool the CPU and both Bridges on the zalman Tower loop,

    and for the GPU loop, A DD setup, What size (model # would help a ton) pump would I need for a single 120mm Radiator and the GPU block?


    <--- sorry I had to, I love it haha
    GPU Block: Swiftech Steath Gefroce 8800 $110
    Pump: D-2 or Swiftech MCP355 $80
    Rad: ThermoChill PA120.1 $95 or Swiftech MCR120 QP-K $35. ThemorChill is the best but cost is triple while Swiftech performing good too.
    Last edited by Deton; 09-01-2008 at 23:49.

  3. #3
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    Thank you for the reply


    I think i may just add the swiftech pump and radiator to my current setup!

    I dont have a program that will tell me my cpu temps ( i usually reset and look in bios) and my main concern currently is about my cpu, the water in the loop is very warm to the touch, which makes me a lil nervous for the cpu.


    Do you know if the danger den Black Ice single 120mm radiators are any good? http://www.dangerden.com/store/produ...1&cat=0&page=1

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    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    Thank you for the reply


    I think i may just add the swiftech pump and radiator to my current setup!

    I dont have a program that will tell me my cpu temps ( i usually reset and look in bios) and my main concern currently is about my cpu, the water in the loop is very warm to the touch, which makes me a lil nervous for the cpu.


    Do you know if the danger den Black Ice single 120mm radiators are any good? http://www.dangerden.com/store/produ...1&cat=0&page=1
    You're welcome!
    You can use CoreTemp or SpeedFan (Freeware) to read CPU temp.
    Black Ice is similar to Swiftech MCR120-QP but the MCR120-QP works well with low RPM fan. You don't want noises with WC.
    You can get a rad with intergated reservoir 120.1 ($35) and a pump MCP-355 ($50) + new tubes and accessories, to cool the CPU for under $100. Now you can use the Zalman system to cool the video card.

  5. #5
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    I um... was looking at dangerden's store, and got a lil excited and bought some stuff... I know I should have gotten someones opinion first :P but it was just too tempting.

    I ordered

    Single 120mm Black ice rad 1/2 OD barb
    a couple 1/2 inch T's
    DD12V-D5 Pump Fixed Speed 1/2 OD barbs (for 1/2 ID tubes)
    DD 5 1/4 Bay reservoir
    Tygon 3603 Tubing 1/2" ID 3/4" OD 5ft.

    Do I need a fill port? or are they only used when you dont want a reservoir?

    This case is going to be so crowded.

    Also my cpu was running at 52c "scary.' I believe it was cause the fluid was about 70% missing, My flow indicator had cracked and was leaking onto my desk, THANKFULLY I had it outside the case sitting next to it, just made a puddle under my tower "eek!"

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    I ordered

    Single 120mm Black ice rad 1/2 OD barb
    a couple 1/2 inch T's
    DD12V-D5 Pump Fixed Speed 1/2 OD barbs (for 1/2 ID tubes)
    DD 5 1/4 Bay reservoir
    Tygon 3603 Tubing 1/2" ID 3/4" OD 5ft.

    Do I need a fill port? or are they only used when you dont want a reservoir?

    This case is going to be so crowded.

    Also my cpu was running at 52c "scary.' I believe it was cause the fluid was about 70% missing, My flow indicator had cracked and was leaking onto my desk, THANKFULLY I had it outside the case sitting next to it, just made a puddle under my tower "eek!"
    Rad: A 120.1 is good enough to cool CPU and perhaps a NB.

    D5 pump: it's good to handle a bigger rad and few more blocks. This is future proof.

    5.25" reservoir - fine.

    Tubing: 1/2"ID & 3/4OD is good but it's too much money $2.00+ a linner foot? and too bulky. You can get the standard vinyl one at the local home hardware store (eg: HomeDepot, Lowes...etc) for $8 per 10' roll. It works as good as Tygon. However, you should go with 7/16" ID tube, this will fit into 1/2" bard as well but smaller OD. This is something to consider about for the next upgrade if you have a small case.

    T-fitting: try to avoid using it, Y- fitting is better - less flow restriction or you can use T line setup as a drain port.

    Filler Port: don't need it if you have a reservoir.

    Edit: Always run leak test before you actually fire up the motherboard. No damages! I say you were lucky this time.
    Last edited by Deton; 14-01-2008 at 16:27.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deton View Post
    Rad: A 120.1 is good enough to cool CPU and perhaps a NB.

    D5 pump: it's good to handle a bigger rad and few more blocks. This is future proof.

    5.25" reservoir - fine.

    Tubing: 1/2"ID & 3/4OD is good but it's too much money $2.00+ a linner foot? and too bulky. You can get the standard vinyl one at the local home hardware store (eg: HomeDepot, Lowes...etc) for $8 per 10' roll. It works as good as Tygon. However, you should go with 7/16" ID tube, this will fit into 1/2" bard as well but smaller OD. This is something to consider about for the next upgrade if you have a small case.

    T-fitting: try to avoid using it, Y- fitting is better - less flow restriction or you can use T line setup as a drain port.

    Filler Port: don't need it if you have a reservoir.

    Edit: Always run leak test before you actually fire up the motherboard. No damages! I say you were lucky this time.
    yea the reserator system worked well for about 3 months, but then the flow indicator cracked... i dont know how, but it was jus tfine before

    i plan on using the t for a dump/drain



    AGAIN I must say! Thank you! youve been a ton of help

    since i already had ordered that 1/2 tubing and all of my barbs are of course 1/2. I went ahead and ordered a new cpu block and gpu block with 1/2 od barbs, DD TDX for CPU and the DD 8800 ultra block, since im retarded and cant find the ones you suggested. (sarcastic about the retard part ) If this doesnt show a significant drop over the passive I guess ill eventually order a larger radiator ( i got my eye on the 120mmx4 at DD)
    Last edited by intex; 15-01-2008 at 04:38.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    yea the reserator system worked well for about 3 months, but then the flow indicator cracked... i dont know how, but it was jus tfine before

    i plan on using the t for a dump/drain
    perhaps defected by craftmanship due to pressure build up


    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    AGAIN I must say! Thank you! youve been a ton of help
    You're very welcome!

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    If this doesnt show a significant drop over the passive I guess ill eventually order a larger radiator ( i got my eye on the 120mmx4 at DD)
    probably not a lot due to single rad.
    Here's something you should cosider about bigger rad.
    1) a high performance custom water cooling do cost a lot.
    2) external (if u have small case) or internal installation. You may have to mod your case or upgrade to bigger case to accomodate quad rad. I personally like internall installation but my TJ09 limited to the rad size so I optted multiple rad setup, such as dual rad + single.
    3) noise level, bigger rad + more fans = noise. get high quality, quite fan (low rpm) but move a lot of air though.
    4) bigger rad + longer path (more than 2 or 3 part to cool) = flow restriction. Now you have to upgrade the pump.

    I don't think you really need quad rad unless you want to cool more than CPU, GPU, RAM, MOFET, NB, SB in a single loop.
    A tripple rad is good enough to cool a Quad core CPU, 2 GPUs, NB and SB as well.
    My advice is to do some homework on the part that you want to buy, understand it's capacity, plan it well. This is my plan before I worked on it

    Dual rad will dissipate the major heat and then the passive reservoir will remove more heat right after. Then cooled coolant will enter the CPU first and the Single rad remove heat from CPU before it enter the video (load temp nerver more than 52c comcard and NB.

    Notice:
    the pump is higher than the reservoir. This is not the best location for the pump. If you can keep it lower than the reservoir so easier to prime it. I had no choice due to space limitation.

    Here are radiator's max capacity to dissipate heat:
    Single 120.1 - 180W
    Dual 120.2 - 350W
    Triple 120.3 - 500W
    Quad 120.4 - 650W

    I notice that you're from Washington DC. You can order online from this vendor http://www.frozencpu.com/ they located in NY.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deton View Post
    perhaps defected by craftmanship due to pressure build up


    You're very welcome!


    probably not a lot due to single rad.
    Here's something you should cosider about bigger rad.
    1) a high performance custom water cooling do cost a lot.
    2) external (if u have small case) or internal installation. You may have to mod your case or upgrade to bigger case to accomodate quad rad. I personally like internall installation but my TJ09 limited to the rad size so I optted multiple rad setup, such as dual rad + single.
    3) noise level, bigger rad + more fans = noise. get high quality, quite fan (low rpm) but move a lot of air though.
    4) bigger rad + longer path (more than 2 or 3 part to cool) = flow restriction. Now you have to upgrade the pump.

    I don't think you really need quad rad unless you want to cool more than CPU, GPU, RAM, MOFET, NB, SB in a single loop.
    A tripple rad is good enough to cool a Quad core CPU, 2 GPUs, NB and SB as well.
    My advice is to do some homework on the part that you want to buy, understand it's capacity, plan it well. This is my plan before I worked on it

    Dual rad will dissipate the major heat and then the passive reservoir will remove more heat right after. Then cooled coolant will enter the CPU first and the Single rad remove heat from CPU before it enter the video (load temp nerver more than 52c comcard and NB.

    Notice:
    the pump is higher than the reservoir. This is not the best location for the pump. If you can keep it lower than the reservoir so easier to prime it. I had no choice due to space limitation.

    Here are radiator's max capacity to dissipate heat:
    Single 120.1 - 180W
    Dual 120.2 - 350W
    Triple 120.3 - 500W
    Quad 120.4 - 650W

    I notice that you're from Washington DC. You can order online from this vendor http://www.frozencpu.com/ they located in NY.

    Sorry i didnt specify :P I'm in washington state, Seattle area. Thats why I've been partial towards dangerden. since I get 3day shipping that arrives the next day!

    Hmm I think i may "copy" you with the 120x2 radiator, I have plenty of room, it just seems crowded cause the power supply is on the bottom(a style i will NEVER buy again) I even have the 200mm exhaust fan on the top which may help with a push\pull config.

    The manual mentions to place the pump in an area with the highest static pressure, would that mean the lowest point in the loop?

    Do you think the pump i got could accomodate the extra radiator?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    Sorry i didnt specify :P I'm in washington state, Seattle area. Thats why I've been partial towards dangerden. since I get 3day shipping that arrives the next day!
    ohhh

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    Hmm I think i may "copy" you with the 120x2 radiator, I have plenty of room, it just seems crowded cause the power supply is on the bottom(a style i will NEVER buy again) I even have the 200mm exhaust fan on the top which may help with a push\pull config.
    My PSU at the bottom as well.
    External rad have a little better cooling than internal rad. Because it draws fresh cool air from out size of the case versus warm air in the case. If you do internal installation just make sure you have a good intake air flow for it.

    Push/Pull configuration?
    I personally don't think it will gain much in the performance. It's only cost you more on the fans and noises. You can use push or pull whatever suite your situation. I used push because it fit perfectly to my case. On the other hand, naturally hot air raise up so it doesn't need a fan to pulling it.

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    The manual mentions to place the pump in an area with the highest static pressure, would that mean the lowest point in the loop?
    Yes, if your reservoir higher than pump. It is much easier for the pump self priming. All you have to do is fill up the res and turn on the pump and gravity will does it job.
    In my case I had no choice, no room left at the bottom (I used to put it at the bottom of the case). This is what I have to do at everytime I have to prime the pump.
    1) fill up the res
    2) till the case side way so the coolant can run into the pump and all the tubes
    3) refill the res
    4) repeat step 2
    5) firring up the pump - Pause
    6) repeat step 3 & 5 until pressure build up in the line.
    It's more work if you keep the pump higher than res.

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    Do you think the pump i got could accomodate the extra radiator?
    No problem.

  11. #11
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    Hi again :P i finally got it set up, just need to add in the second radiator tonight when i get off work. I have it set up as below.

    Pump
    CPU
    GPU
    120x1 Rad
    Reservoir
    Pump

    Theres about 8feet of tubing used all together

    The water in the system is staying below room temp ( i dont have a thermo to check it) and my gpu is popping up to 59c under load but within 5-6 seconds of being out of game it drops down to 52c. is this normal?

    what is a realistic temperature for an 8800 with water? I used arctic silver and it hasnt set yet.

    Im also adding the 120x2 X cross Black ice Rad tonight ( enters one end and exits on the other)

    Oh and the reservoir is kinda pissing me off, the way the opening is on it, it drops down about 1cm into the reservoir so you cant top it off, even if you tilt the case back. So with the pressure the pump creates and the speed it pushes the water through, it creates a little tornado effect in the reservoir and it splashes around. sounds like someone is pee ing in my case

    Im almost done with this project! yay!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    Hi again :P i finally got it set up, just need to add in the second radiator tonight when i get off work. I have it set up as below.

    Pump
    CPU
    GPU
    120x1 Rad
    Reservoir
    Pump

    Theres about 8feet of tubing used all together
    Congrat, on your sucessed project!
    8' tube is not bad. The shorter tube the better flow rate you get.

    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    The water in the system is staying below room temp ( i dont have a thermo to check it) and my gpu is popping up to 59c under load but within 5-6 seconds of being out of game it drops down to 52c. is this normal?

    what is a realistic temperature for an 8800 with water? I used arctic silver and it hasnt set yet.

    Im also adding the 120x2 X cross Black ice Rad tonight ( enters one end and exits on the other)
    If your ambient temp is low, it's also help your cooling as well.
    Your graphic card's temp seem normal since you only used a single rad. What is the CPU temp now?

    My 8800GTS temp is around 42c-47c idle, load is 52c (while playing game).
    You'll get better temp when AS5 settled in and the second rad added.


    Quote Originally Posted by intex View Post
    Oh and the reservoir is kinda pissing me off, the way the opening is on it, it drops down about 1cm into the reservoir so you cant top it off, even if you tilt the case back. So with the pressure the pump creates and the speed it pushes the water through, it creates a little tornado effect in the reservoir and it splashes around. sounds like someone is pee ing in my case

    Im almost done with this project! yay!
    What kind of reservoir is it?
    You don't need to top it full. If there are no leak then just let the system run for a while, this is will help to remove all the air strapped in the loop, also keep the reservoir cap off while you doing this. About 2 hours later check the coolant level, top it up if necessary, put the cap back and enjoy. DON'T FORGET to check for a leak again later because after the coolant heat up, the tube, the seals (o-rings) heat up as well. It's might leak if it wasn't tied tight.

    Tip: if you see bubbles formming in the reservoir then there're still air strap in your loop.

    By the way, the nose suppose to go way after you do the bleeding. If it dosen't then the reservoir was bad designed.

  13. #13
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    Its a dangerden single 5.25 drive bay reservoir. it has a little retaining wall in the middle so the fluid swirls around on the inlet side, Im kinda afraid to run it with the reser open, the fluid in there is moving so fast i think it may shoot out lol.

    Also the fluid is moving so quickly it sometimes sucks the air out of the reservoir and down through the loop.

    when i get home ill mess with it some more try and clear the air.

    For clamps i used automotive steel hose clamps, ones that require a screwdriver to tighten them down, i checked to make sure they didnt slice the tubes anywhere that i tightened them down.

    Do you know how to make the fluid glow? i have 2 leds that fit into the back of my reservoir but they just make the reservoir glow and the first foot or so of the hoses.

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    About fluid; you have to use UV active fluid and UV light to make it glow. Some of this fluid comes with premixed or you have to add the color dye in by yourself. Keep this in mind; if you have to mix it, don't put too much of the dye or it won't work or it could cause residue build up in the loops. LED lights doesn't work well as UV light with this fluid.

    Does your pump have adjustable speed? you might have to slow it down.
    Let me guess, your bay reservoir is about 2" height? A single bay res, right? Maybe it is not deep enough and too much pressure cause the fluid to twirl.

    I have 2 reservoirs, A Swiftech Micro (4"Hx3"Wx1.5"D) and XPS 150mm cylinder type (about 5"H) and never experience and noises.

  15. #15
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    I ran the reservoir open. it splashed a little out onto my desk lol

    It quieted down a little when i filled it back up.

    I hate to ask more questions but I got a new problem the case I have (antec 900) won't fit my 120.2 on the top. or anywhere else for that matter, would you have any suggestions of what case would be big enough?











    Also the side of the case wont go back on cause of the radiator

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    Ok, let solve your problem without spending any big money on a new case unless you have too.

    First of all. Can you put the single rad on the top exhaust fan? What size of that fan 160mm or 120mm? It looks kinda big.

    If it's fit then I have a solution for you;
    1) put single rad on top
    2) use swiftech MCB-120 radbox, only $20, to install the dual rad externally at the back of the case, see sample pic.
    3) try to shorten you tubes a little bit, don't do a big circle loop like you have. I know a big thick tube very hard to do the bending at short radius but try your best. The shorter tube you have the better flow rate you are going to get.
    4) put the bottom at the bottom of the case, close to the PSU.



    What do you mean the case's side panel won't close? Rad too big or it's cause by the tubes?

    If you have to purchase a new case. What's your budget?

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